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by hoops, Mohr Park,
on May 19, 2013
As one who recently returned to California after having lived in British Columbia, Texas, Kentucky, Florida I would say at this point no. My sister lives in Dallas and she is currently paying $3.31 a gallon for gas and housing is better quality and more affordable. Florida has zero state income tax and better schools. Honestly, I think the only think California has going for it is good weather within 40 miles of the coast. We are trying to get transferred out again.
California is not worth the price when the 'price' is bankruptcy brought on by unsustainably high public worker salaries and pensions. The state is unable to pay its workers and retirees an ever growing (like a crescendo of water) amount that is and will be placed on the shoulders of our children, grandchildren, great grandchildren, great great grandchildren, and no doubt even great great great grandchildren. This is why Phil Mikkelsen is considering moving to another state. If you look at Calpers and Calstrs, they are underwater - and this even before the big kahuna tsunami washes over future generations. We're broke. We're busted. And all that is missing is the roar of water about to cascade over the entire state, and beyond. When, you ask? It is coming....
Arnold is right. Jerry Brown lied to us a few weeks after he got his TAX proposition passed. Suddenly he announced CA was rich ! ! !
A MUST read is in today's SUN Contra Costa, Tri-Valley Times...BayAreaNews Group. The SUN editorial is about our CA state public pensions which will take generations to get flush. Meanwhile we, our children, and grandchildren will have to pay those horrendous
pensions, ahead of and INSTEAD of meeting obligations to children elderly, roads, etc, etc. the list of what CA will have to do without, even though continuing to pay staggering pensions. The crooks in our CA legislature continue to ignore the unfunder liability, while writing NEW expensive crap that we cannot afford ! !
If only jerry would control HIS Sacto team... He told us, they were his Dems and he would make them act responsibility.... When will we see a STOP to all that we cannot afford. It's not fair to our kids
to continue social spending, while ignoring the pension nightmare.
It's time for honesty. Reas today's Times editorial.
"Florida has zero state income tax and better schools"
Better than Pleasanton, Dublin, or San Ramon? I didn't see it when I lived in Florida. Better than Stockton or Hayward, sure. Good districts in Florida are hard to find, average school districts are easy to find.
We know we pay more than is fair, logical, necessary. We know those of us who actually pay, pay more than we should, and to date we have chosen to stay. We pay more than in other states.
Also, we are the most generous state for 'free rides'. CA legislature 'hands out' more than other states. The 'takers' take so much, there is nothing for roads, and state necessities for ALL of CA....like it is suppose to. Not 'hand outs' to every kind of 'selected' group that did not exist 50 years ago. Legis just creates new hand outs to "BUY" votes with tax dollars that are suppose to maintain our infrastructure !!! Taxpayers need to demand that our $$ go for 'the people's structure'. Sacto should not act like the Salvation Army.
As the pension shortfall burdens us in future years, more of us, will be leaving CA. Already those leaving were greater than those arriving!!! Not surprising ! It will be even more next year.
We also lived in the Mission San Jose area of Fremont and do not kid yourself as Amador, Foothill, et al do not even remotely compare with Mission San Jose High School. Our oldest daughter went to Mission and could barely compete at Mission after being the top of her class at PMS. We transferred and came back this time to Pleasanton and we were surprised how very easy Foothill was by comparison. I do however hold out hope for Pleasanton because the influx of Asians into our community will drive academic performance through the roof. Asians are great for a community and will drive up real estate values just like they did in the Mission San Jose area. We are going to transfer but for those of you who stay please beware because your kids are really going to need to up their game to compete.
I moved my family here from Mission San Jose before my children entered high school. They attend Amador Valley and there are a few reasons we moved. It is easier for my kids to be at the top of their classes here and the housing is cheaper. I agree with Paula that as more people come from Fremont this will change, my eldest is a senior and her younger brother is a freshman. I can already see his class is much more competitive than hers. Perhaps we will see movement to Livermore to find easier schools too?
No, it is not worth it.
I've been to Dallas. It is a pit. I wouldn't pay any amount of money to live there. I paid $4 for premium gas in beautiful California today and can't think of a single reason why I'd want to go to Dallas to pay $3.31.
Lower gas prices in Texas are only part of the miracle of Texas. Additionally, Texans pay lower taxes. And Texas' debt per capita ranks 45th in the nation. Also, and most significantly, Texas places less onerous constraints on its residents who are happy driving without the government insisting on putting costly so-called pollution curbing additives in their gas tanks. Another real success story is Texas' absence of regulatory constraints on businesses who want to help grow the economy without being saddled with costly health, safety, and pollution regulations. Whether it's chemical refineries or pesticide plants, Texans can gaze upon their companies with pride when they look at end of year profits reports.
This is in distinct contrast to California which is soon to be overwhelmed by an enormous tidal wave caused by greedy public workers who now draw salaries and pensions that are unsustainable. Look at Calpers and Calstrs, which claim to be solvent but in fact are performing an elaborate shell game on the beach while, right before their eyes their children play on the beach while a tsunami forms on the horizon, threatening to inundate children and grand children and especially great grand children. See Californiatsunami.com for more information. Moving to Texas is one's best bet. The minor inconveniences of workplace accidents, pollution, and an occasional chemical explosion in one's neighborhood all pale in contrast to the tsunami of union worker-created debt that plagues California and will be effectively the end of the state after the tsunami hits with full force, sometime in the distant future.
Why are you always so grumpy and rude?
Dallas is very nice as are parts of California. If you want to pay over top dollar for sub par service then that is your choice. Just as it is the choice of others with money to vote with their feet.
b, please try to be considerate of others and their opinions.
California is a basket case. It is now considered THE most difficult state for businesses in the country. We are ranked in the top 3 in the amount of taxes we have to pay, yet what we get in return is pathetic. The state is bankrupt. The state has become a magnet for welfare scammers, perverts, and druggies. Half of the people in the state don't speak English. We are governed by a bunch of idiots. We are on the path to becoming a state that is like a third world country. The only good thing about California is Silicon Valley jobs and the weather, and the pathetic state of the state is driving those Silicon Valley jobs to other states.
Nice read Arnold. But you may want to think about the 14 people who died and all the people who lost everything in the West Texas explosion. Thanks to the business friendly State of Texas, the company that caused all this death and destruction only carried 1 million dollars liability insurance and once that is gone they will file bankruptcy leaving these people without any recourse. But I guess this is good for business and profits. Hook'em Horns.
Yes, it is unfortunate that people occasionally die, but such is the price of living in a free nation. People would rather suffer occasional deaths from unregulated chemical explosions than pay over $4.00 for a gallon of gas. People would rather suffer occasional ill health on account of employer rights to pollute the atmosphere and water than pay higher taxes. That is what has made this country so great, its freedom.
When we look at California, its obvious that an enormous tsunami is going to hit. Just look at Calpers and Calstrs, who claim to be solvent, but they are hoodwinking us and down the road, in the future, our grandkids and great grandkids may have to pay higher taxes in order to stave off a huge wave of bankruptcies across the state. Meanwhile the political class continues to rake in exorbitant salaries and pensions that are unsustainable, unless revenues increase or taxes are raised. What is most important is that we keep matters in perspective. 14 people died in Texas, which is a very large state; 4 people died in Benghazi, and that was a very small compound. I've done the math. When you calculate the odds, I'd much rather live in Texas than in Benghazi, especially with this administration of incompetents. But to stay on point, taxes in Texas are lower than in California, and that's why Phil Mikkelsen and others are complaining and threatening to move to Texas. In short, there can be no golf after everything is drenched by an avalanche of tsunami devastation.
Arnold, thank you for your insight but really including Benghazi into your comments and calling this the administration of incompetents. Common Arnold you are better than that. And if you feel that way then you have every right. But if you are a fair person as you seem, then you need to review history and take a look at the 13 embassy attacks the US suffered under George Bush and then Americans who lost their lives.
I will use your words and stay on point, yes the pension situation is terrible and we have many people and many years of fault to spread around. Yes Texas has cheaper taxes but obviously from your writings, no matter how much you complain, there must be something about this State, or the City of Pleasanton that keeps you here. So smile and enjoy the weather and the beautiful sunshine. Because regardless if we like or not, this is still our home.
CV - is it the exhaust from the Richmond refinery fire thats clouding your memory? Or maybe it's the San Bruno incident you are overlooking or maybe the Walnut Creek pipeline explosion. Can you hook me up with pair of those rosy-colored glasses you got?
The Obama administration has been incompetent from the start. They were warned about an attack on the embassy, then the attack occurred and the administration failed to scramble jets from Italy or Germany, and finally it lied about the attack, saying it was an "act of terror" rather than a "terrorist act." We can argue about this some other time. You may have had difficulties with George W. Bush, and some of our pension problems were furthered by Mr. Bush, but he never lied to us.
More to the point. Living in freedom means living at risk. I'd much rather live under possibility of a factory exploding in my neighborhood than see the kinds of overregulation that lead only to diminished freedom and higher taxes. And it is higher taxes we are bound to pay, perhaps not us, but our children's children, and their children, and their children, and beyond, and that isn't fair to future generations. Don't they have rights? I ask you. Why should we let a tsunami of pension-based debt wash over the land and drown our grandkids and great grand kids when we can do something now, beginning with a decertification of unions, a 40% pay cut across the board, and an elimination of pensions, for the good of all Americans, especially those who haven't been born yet and so don't have the right to voice their democratic right to resist higher taxes.
Have you seen Calpers and Calstrs? It is appalling. A steep and mountainous surge of debt-laden waters that is likely at some point in the future to wash over the entire land from sea to sea, and beyond. Texas may not be far enough, given its level terrain. Perhaps mountainous Alaska is the better option. We're still deciding, but like I say, its the rights of the unborn of this century and especially the next that we must try to protect.
FriSuite, no my memory hasn't forgotten the PGE tragedy or Chevron or Walnut Creek Pipeline. But thank you because you made my point. These companies paid a great deal of money to the victims and many have rebuilt their lives as best as they could.In PGE's case if the ruling stands, they will pay even more. In Texas the Company that caused the destruction paid very little and those whose homes and families were shattered have nothing to show for it.
Arnold, Arnold, Arnold, shame on you. George Bush never lied to us. You should know better than that. We as a country are still paying for President Bush's mis-truths. As for the pensions we agree. The pensions are in a very serious mess and needs to be handle now rather than later. But really Arnold go out and get some sun. It will do you good.
And if I may mention alongside of FnSuite, although San Bruno and Walnut Creek were insured because of onerous state regulations, and they weren't allowed to co-exist with schools, preschools, and homes for the elderly within a couple hundred feet, again because of harsh govt mandates.
But in West, Texas, the people who lived there were free to move. And the volunteer firefighters who lost their lives didn't have to volunteer if they didn't want to. That's the essence of American freedom.
But it is future generations that is of most concern to me. What chance will they have 40, 60, maybe even 100 years from now with the crushing build-up of debt being accrued as we speak? There is a tsunami building, and future generations haven't the ability to speak out against an unfair tax system that puts most of the burden on the future middle class all so that public servants can milk the system dry with high salaries and pensions. Until we solve this problem, no finger in a dyke will be adequate. The tsunami that hits will be of a frightening size, and we are all doomed unless we do something about the public pension problem. Calpers and Calstrs claim they are solvent, and they may be, but what about the future? They aren't nearly so confident, claiming they don't know what the economy will look like in 40-60 years. Well, that's what Greece said, and look at it now. But our system is much worse, with the eruption of water being far more forceful because of government regulations.
Arnold, so what your saying is businesses in Texas shouldn't have the same mandates and regulations including insurance as the Companies in Calif are required to do? You mentioned freedom in Texas. Do you think those volunteer Fireman who went to fight that fire knew that the Company had illegally stored more fertilizer than they were suppose to? Do you think the people that died and those who lost everything anticipated the Company not being responsible enough to carry proper insurance coverages? Yes they were free to live in West Texas as responsible Americans. I would think they would expect the same responsibilities out of the Businesses in their city.
As for the tragedies here, I am glad there were regulations for the businesses involved. And I am glad these companies were forced to have insurance, enough insurance, to cover unforeseen events. People lost loved ones and their homes. Their lives will never be the same and memories were destroyed at no fault of their own. But at least some of them will rebuild.
Patriotic Americans gave up their lives at the Alamo in order to live in freedom, have their own land, to own guns, and possess slaves if they so desired. This was before the era of liberal regulations. I wonder what those patriots would say today if they were confronted with the numbers that show Calpers and Calstrs being on the edge of bankruptcy? When defending the Alamo, patriots were faced with waves of Mexican soldiers led by Santa Ana. Today, we're attempting to defend against waves of public school teachers, policemen and firemen, careening out of control, caught up in a massive wave of greed and other excesses with little concern about children in the late 21st or 22nd century.
Volunteers are volunteers. Employers are our modern day heroes. They create jobs and, if it weren't for excessive regulations making them insure themselves and curbing their God-given right to pollute, more people today would be working. I'd be willing to die for my right to pollute if through my pollution I might be able to hire a single person. When I see smog, I say to myself "Yes, this is the color of American freedom."
I personally wouldn't have volunteered in Texas. I've chosen for myself to be a Volunteer of America, championing the rights of polluters to pollute, and those who don't like it may do themselves a favor by contemplating the super-natural force of a tsunami which is inevitable because of unsustainable teacher salaries and pensions, and cops and fire fighters too. We have too many of them. They're pay is too high. And their pensions are like festering volcanoes in the middle of the ocean which, at a certain point, are going to erupt and cause an unstoppable tsunami that will inevitably lead to higher taxes for future generations. Give me liberty or give me death!
I've visited 41 of the 50 states and lived in 7 of them. No other state can even come close to California when it comes to gorgeous weather, diversity of the people, plenty of job opportunities, and restaurants for the uncompromising palate. Yes, it is expensive to live here for a good reason. Many of my coworkers who moved to crap-hole <fill in a state name here> later moved back because the life here is second to none.
Arnold, I have read your words on pensions and some things you bring up make sense. However when you drift from the subject of pensions, you take yourself on a magical mystery tour. Your opinions of pollution and business regulations and the safety involved in making sure the general public is protected is amazing.Before you talk about these subjects, do yourself and the rest of us a favor and do your homework on those subjects. The regulations are there to protect us and even you.
To all of you born or not born in this area, if you don't like PLEASE move out. We locals, including those that have become Tri-Valley residents, love it here. Perhaps you should move on.
Disgruntle with our local area? Please move to Wyoming, Nevada, Iowa, Alabama, but please get the heck out of here.
It's time for Arnold, et al to move on or move back to where they came from.
California is the golden state for those who wish to make it work. The "Land of Opportunity" is never more evident than in this some-what dysfunctional state. My folks move here during WWII from the Dakotas. They couldn't believe that you walk down the main street you could buy fruit during the winter.
"We also lived in the Mission San Jose area of Fremont and do not kid yourself as Amador, Foothill, et al do not even remotely compare with Mission San Jose High School."
I'm looking really hard and can't see anywhere that I compared Mission San Jose to Amador or Foothill. I compared Tri-Valley schools to public schools in Florida. When we lived in Florida, we found the schools to be generally dreadful in quality, even in fairly affluent suburban school districts.
Please check US News and World report ranking of the nations best high schools or just type in Mission San Jose High School ranking on your URL Mission San Jose ranks 10th in the state and 79th in the Nation including private and catholic schools. Mission also has an advanced placement participation rate of 85%. Newsweek ranks Mission 10th nationally in math and science and #1 when excluding private schools.
I went to Mission and my son is a junior at Amador and I can tell you there is no comparison.
Most of these posts have nothing to do with the original question. Everyone gets off on their own little agenda. California has like everywhere else...good and bad. If you move to Texas, the cost of living is much better but the weather and job opportunities are not. California has high crime, traffic and cost of living. But the quality of living is great and the location, weather can't be beat. If you don't like it here, leave..I'll take your parking spot.
Billie and Paula,
Maybe they never taught you to read at Mission San Jose, but I never compared Mission San Jose to anything. I compared tri-valley schools to schools in Florida. I have news for you: Mission San Jose is in California, not Florida! I never said anything about Mission San Jose. Why do you and "Paula" keep saying that I'm mistaken about Mission San Jose, when I've said nothing about it, other than that it is in California, not Florida?
Arnold, they teach creationism in texas public schools. Enough said!
California has problems with pensions but so does Texas. This is just an article with an example:
"Texas lawmakers move to indirectly boost their own pensions "
oh yeah, and read about Houston and its pension problems
and read here about the budget crisis in the Texas public schools:
Calif has more to offer than any other state and that is a fact.It of course has it's problems as well.The weather is such a major factor......I do not know how people deal with the snow and humidity of most everywhere else.
Mission San Jose has become a self fulfilled prophecy.Once it started to be recognized as a good school more and more Asians were determined to go there until today when they dominate the school.You have a student body composed of kids driven by academic minded parents,many who have made great financial sacrifices to move into the district.The teachers are not better but they are lucky to have a student body that is highly motivated so the result are great test scores.The US mag rating the schools is meaningless.They simply compile data about test scores.There is more to a school being a great school than AP numbers.
An interesting comparison is Mission and Bishop O'Dowd in Oakland.One public and one private.Mission has slightly higher test scores but does that make it a better school?O'Dowd has a more diverse student body,a great athletic program and music/drama program and I would say a more well rounded,real life experience as well as an excellent education.Just a matter of opinion.
Sure we can allways find something to pick on if we look hard enough. I am 5th generation Californian and proud of it. I have traveled to 32 of our great states as well as Europe Australia and Mexico and have yet to find better or more diverse place to live. For the those you that feel that someplace else is better please go enjoy your hot and humid summers and freezing wet and winters. While I enjoy the mild weather. Lets take this weekend for example I will spend Friday evening in beautiful SF, Saturday we will go wine tasting in world class Napa valley and Sunday in Carmel. So please move to whatever state country you prefer leave. Because if you leave it mean the roads will be less crowded for those of us that appreciate what we have.
My family are legal immigrants from USSR and are currently citizens of America.
Our impression is that California is moving to the direction of third- world dictatorship as a high speed train moves toward a broken bridge. Housing regulations created situation when no working Californian can afford buying single family house. As every other undeveloped country sales their natural resources, California sales its land to wealthy foreigners. Young Californian families have to chose between overpriced tiny apartments or spending hours in a traffic.
Taxation policies keep California as the worst place for businesses in US. Web Link
First amendment rights in public schools are long time forgotten; religious, racial and gender discriminations are stronger than 10 years ago, they just changed race and replaced gender with sexual orientation; corruption of government and unions can easily compete with USSR and South America.
Is there any hope that Californians will finally stop dreaming? We'll see it in 2014.
Your comments are similar to those I have heard from other people I know that immigrated to the United States from countries that were part of the former Soviet Union. Upon coming to the U. S., they lived in one or more other states before moving to California. They refer to California being somewhere politically between the Midwest U. S. and the Soviet Union, and rapidly moving toward the Soviet style of government. Universally, they think this is a great tragedy and feel that a great many people in the U. S. under the age of 40 are clueless about government and what they are losing.
AnnaS and Bug, my wife works with several people who either came here directly or were born here after their family immigrated from the Soviet Union. They say the same thing and can't believe the people don't see what is happening. We are slowing being moved to tyranny. California is moving faster, but as the old saying goes "As California goes, so goes the nation." For those commenting that stayed on topic, California, by nature, has many benefits that make living here worth it, but that is slowly changing. Ask yourself what changes have occurred over the past 20 to 30 years in California. Retiring here has become more difficult finically. Raising a family has become more difficult. The Bay Area and much of it's surroundings such as Pleasanton resembles the Capitol in The Hunger Games. The rest of the districts are not doing well.
Home prices are rising again as always occurs in this cyclic market. We are selling our home this time around and moving out of the state. Our daughter is doing the same thing since she does not want to raise her children here.
It is a fact of life that Calif is expensive....yet so many people choose to live here for all of the reasons already stated.It is simply a choice for the individual to decide if the price is worth it.
Comparing Russia to Calif is ludicrous in any way.There is simply no valid comparison.If you immigrate here and have little money why on earth would you choose the most expensive place to live and then complain about the fact you cannot afford it?
Living in CA is worth exactly what we pay. If it wasnt, people would move out and we'd be paying less. What you value and what its worth is different for everyone. Weather, schools, job availability, housing, are all things that some will gladly pay for and some will find ridiculous...just as ridiculous as posing this question. Anyone who says its not worth it is falsely elevating one value's worth and discounting another value's worth in their mind.
I dont want to live in Manhattan, but its worth it for the ones that pay to live there. I happily live in CA because its worth it for me.
Hoops, if you think that a cost of living is what makes California similar to USSR, you need to learn history and economy. California is getting more and more similar to third word dictatorship because people are having less and less freedom here, because middle class is disappearing and only super-rich and very poor are left,because the government is getting bigger and have more control and as government control growth, the corruption of government growth with it. You can continue dreaming your dream. But, please don't be surprised if one day you'll get a notice that you occupy the area which belongs to People's Republic of China and unless you are an attractive woman 25 years old or younger you must move out from your house to a place designated to you by a Chinese representative. If you think it can never happened, read history of Europe before WWII. Jews there also believed that Germany was a civilized country which can never burn people alive.
Actually, reading the real history of America can also help.
AnnAss, bugsplat, dude, this is exactly what I have been saying. Even a most cursory look at Calpers and Calstrs amply indicates that we are not at all far removed from Mao's China or Lenin's Soviet Union. When the government extracts too many taxes from its citizens, it then must spend even more to misinform them and keep them controlled. The horror in our case is that an enormous tsunami, and I mean Big, is threatening to inundate the entire state and yet we hear nothing about it. All the liberal press can report on is high school drop-out rates, impoverished children, racial inequality, joblessness, but I am here to tell you these are mere drops in the bucket of turbulent waters being churned up by the tsunamic forces brought about by union teachers and police/fire personnel simply making too much money at the public's expense. The comparison of California to the Soviet Union is the most accurate I've seen. Thank you.
California is the fourth state for me and the one I'm least likely to retire in - expensive, crowded, horrible drivers, with a large majority of very rude people! Not sure why California pays a premium for everything - Utah has a far better climate, landscape, and friendly population. Lived there for 5 years a few decades ago and could definitely see myself retiring there and leaving the unfriendly lousy drivers of CA behind...not to mention the HIGH tax rates and various bridge tolls.
I have owned 12 homes and, in my 64 years, have lived in, virtually every part of the US. Pleasanton and CA in general is the best place I have ever lived. It is expensive; the best usually is! If you want cheap, move to Texas, Oklahoma or Alabama; you will wish you were back here!
When you return to the great state of Utah, any chance you might take those annoying white-shirted guys on bikes who wear those black ties with you? Thanks! We're really going to miss you!
Anna....I never said anything about the cost of living.To compare Calif to Russia is ridiculous on any level,period.Your argument and your knowledge of history is your reality and maybe one tenth of one percent of every other educated person in this country.Go live in Russia for a few years and I think your opinion of Calif will change.
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