Jesus Frieks downtown with signs and yelling Around Town, posted by Jon, a resident of the Danbury Park neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 9:57 am
Whats up with these Jesus Freaks that come downtown on weekends in the summer? They are very aggressive and shout inappropriate things directly at people. The police say they have the right to do this. I have seen them yelling at young children saying "you are a homosexual, god with punish you" and things of that nature. I understand they are from Modesto and will not reveal ANY church affiliation. One of them told me that the guy who stands on the milk crate shouting bible versus and condemning people, IS the Messiah!! They always have video cameras in case of conflict. There is a theory that these folks are just NUT, looking for a violent confrontation, seeking a lawsuit against some rich Pleasanton resident. Someone will be hurt eventually I think. Sure makes summer evening unpleasant and hurts business.
Posted by Question, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 1:17 pm
Hi, so where are you all seeing these people? I'm interested in steering clear of them with my toddler and preschool aged children...
If NO ONE engages them, hopefully they'll just go away. If you can, cross the street if you have to be where they are and avoid them. Hopefully that will send a message to them that what they are doing is offensive.
While I agree they have their first ammendment rights to do as they want, I'm a Christian and active in my church and we certainly do support missionary work, local and international, etc, but I have never seen this done. I was even an officer in a student missionary club in college and have been on several mission trips in my lifetime...and I have NEVER heard of anyone witnessing in this manner unless they are a pseudochurch or cult members.
SCARY! Perhaps the police should be called because of the speakers offensive language or scare tactics. I think there is a decency clause in most of the city civic codes. Ah, well, I hear pretty yucky language from the town teenagers just sitting at Cold Stone with my little kids often enough...
Posted by Jon, a resident of the Danbury Park neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 2:42 pm
Question,
You pegged it:
"pseudochurch or cult members"
Like I said, I tried to engage the guy who yells inappropriate things from the milk crate with NO luck. When I asked the other guy why he wouldn't speak with me, the other guys said that he "was the messiah" and didn't want to speak to imortals like me!
They have been comming down by Tully's Coffee for the last two summers, mostly on Friday or Saturday night. They cause QUITE a stir with the bikers and folk with small children. Like I sai, they videotape everything. They will NOT reveal any church affiliation.
The police can do nothing because of the free speach. Last year they said City Council was considering an ordinance and an offical "fee speach" area in town, perhaps some remote park, which is legal to impliment.
Posted by Cholo, a resident of Livermore, on Jun 26, 2009 at 3:07 pm
What does "Frieks" mean? I think that christians need to do an about face and march off into the sunset. Toward the dark side of the moon! How come you can't tolerate people yelling, so many of you have such big mouths and what comes out is almost complete nonsense.
You often come across as so filthy, anti-semitic, racist, prancing little nazis, give it a serious rest mes petites. Please...
Posted by mac, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 4:05 pm
I'm guessing Cholo is somehow behind this 'downtown event', don'tcha think? Well, we've learned to tolerate him, so I suppose we can learn to tolerate the nasties and hope they'll go away.
What about public nuisances, though? I do think there are ordinances about that, so maybe it will come down to the verbage that is currently written or how it needs to be revised. One shouldn't be able to "impose" on or "impact another's enjoyment of the great outdoors.
Posted by Question, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 4:07 pm
Hi Cholo,
Even though you lumped all Christians into a group and told us to "march off into the sunset" and some other less than kind things, I am still going to respond to what seemed a sincere question. If not then maybe it will help someone else...
To witness simply means to testify to what One has seen/heard/experienced. Relative to Christians it simply means to share what we have experienced in our own lives with Jesus Christ. It is exactly what happens on the witness stand in a court. Regardless of anyone's opinion, it is your experience. That's what Christian's mean when they say they are witnessing to others. You share your personal faith experience with others that want to know.
I hope that helps, and I also really hope that you will not lump all of us Christians into a group with others that don't believe what we do and that you would not be so quick to push us to the side. We have important things to say also.
Posted by Stacey, a resident of the Amberwood/Wood Meadows neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 4:17 pm Stacey is a member (registered user) of PleasantonWeekly.com
Posted by Original Joe, a resident of the Downtown neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 5:37 pm
They have the right of free speech, but they do not have the right to create a disturbance or become a public nuisance. All the police need to do is observe and cite and remove. But I suspect that nothing will be done until the three main businesses on that corner close their doors and complain to the city...it'll only take a few hours, at most, and the "frieks" will be "preaching" in Santa Rita.
Loud motorcycles and now loud mouths...that's why I stay home and I live within walking distance with my money unspent. Do you hear me, business people, you need to make the move if you want my money.
Posted by Jill, a resident of the Birdland neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 5:58 pm
I would bet that if everyone quit buying ice cream, burritos, and coffee and these "people" lost their audience and had to move to, lets say, the Blue Agave area that they wouldn't be there for long. Free speech be damned ! This has nothing to do with free speech, so suck it up, get rid of these freaks, let them run to the networks for their 90 seconds of fame that nobody will remember and end this fiasco. It seems like the city is more worried about "bad press" than losing business on Main St.
Posted by Mike, a resident of the Carriage Gardens neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 6:23 pm
What about the weirdo men in suits who try to give religious propaganda to the kids as they leave middle schools? They don't care that they're distracting children who are trying to cross the street, make their bus, or look for their ride. That's a dangerous time to be getting in kid's faces.
Posted by Just ignore them, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 6:53 pm
I think the staying away from them and ignoring them is the best.
I once went to school with a kid that was "challenged" socially. He decided to make my group of friends his new target. At first we tried to be nice, but then it got wierd, so while this may seem mean, we literally ignored him. We didn't respond to anything he said. He eventually (it took a while - like I said he was socially "challenged"), moved on to another group of kids. It may not have been the nicest way to handle it, but it was better than yelling at him or humiliating him in person like others did.
I think these people feel like they have something to say. That's fine, just don't go there and move away from them. Just get your food to go and steer clear. Not hard to do...
Posted by What you mean ?, a resident of the Downtown neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 7:29 pm
How do you ignore them and steer clear if that's where you want to go? The other poster was right, the businesses need to put an end to this and push the button and force the city into action, or else close their doors when these people are creating this disturbance. Free speach does not allow a person to create a disturbance.
Posted by Just ignore them, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 7:42 pm
What do you mean?
I mean that I didn't read where they are blocking the doorway to the businesses. Apparently, some guys is located somewhere on that corner...just stay away from him.
Yes, I think the businesses should do what they can, but personally, I'd appreciate it if they'd also include the skateboarders, loiters, unsupervised teenagers, smokers, etc. They just don't seem to be interested in dealing with any of it, so my simple point was if you need what the businesses have, just get it to go and steer clear of the scary people (who I highly doubt are anything but dubious individuals).
Posted by Jon, a resident of the Danbury Park neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 9:00 pm
Original Joe,
"They have the right of free speech, but they do not have the right to create a disturbance or become a public nuisance. All the police need to do is observe and cite and remove. But I suspect that nothing will be done until the three main businesses on that corner close their doors and complain to the city...it'll only take a few hours, at most, and the "freaks" will be "preaching" in Santa Rita"
These people have even been VERY rude to the police on several occasions. Although they do tone down the really heavy stuff, like calling kids "homosexuals and forncators" and telling them they will "burn in hell" etc. That idea of video taping THEM from a distance is a good idea. As I said they will actually come up to families and bikers and get right in their face screaming this stuff.
They must have a motive and a lawyer lined up, for a potential lawsuit. I have heard them almost BEG people to "touch or hit" them while another was honing in with their video camera.
Just ignore them,
"I think these people feel like they have something to say. That's fine, just don't go there and move away from them. Just get your food to go and steer clear. Not hard to do..."
These folks live in the Central Valley, NOT Pleasanton. We own a home, pay property taxes, pay sales taxes etc. in Pleasanton. The Tully's "farmers market" hub area is a fine place to eat, get a coffee, an ice cream etc. and sit and relax with the kids. Also it is walking distance. The first time we experienced these folk, we had just ordered a nice meal at Fontinas, outdoors and the rest of the restaurant was full to capacity. That was a miserable experience.
If the PPD and City council has not done anything by now, I don't think they will. The police are called EVERY time these folks start up and they stand around for a while. They can NOT do anything!
Posted by Take it to a whole new level, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 9:09 pm
Can we get a restraining order? Can we invite a band to make a LOT of noise (drowning out the "brethren"?). I may have watched too many Westerns growing up, but can't a group of men from town head down there "armed" with pepper spray or a megaphone or airhorn, etc and annoy the he** outta them? What can we legitimately do if they are literally approaching people - especially the kids? I'm AM serious. Can we escalate it just enough to get the police involved (like they should feel threatened enough to call!)?
Posted by Jon, a resident of the Danbury Park neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 9:21 pm
Take it to a whole new level,
Nope, can't get a restraing order. Believe me so many business owners and citizens have complained to the City, called the police etc. and BY LAW there is NOTHING the POLICE can do, UNLESS they treaten or attack someone. Even bad language and yelling at kids, that they are sinner and homosexual etc. apparnatly is NOT a crime.
Acourding to police it's a free speech law and based uopn the number of people preaching, speaking etc. A BAND however does require a permit! They can not be annoyed out of town. peole get in their face, heckle them and they love it! As I said, they WANT a confrontation! The police are always called and involved. They come around for a while, then leave.
Posted by Take it to a whole new level, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 9:26 pm
Jon,
I vote an airhorn. Everytime they talk shoot if off. I bet you'll get applause. We should give water guns to the kids. I bet the police won't do anything about that either...oops little Timmy just hit the looney...AGAIN! :)
Posted by Jill, a resident of the Birdland neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 10:18 pm
Don't tell me the police and the city can't do anything because I don't buy it. If that "crap" was going on in front of one of the upscale places on Main St. it would end quickly. Maybe the city thinks that this is a colorful attraction, but it isn't. Until the city does something I stay home or spend my money in Dublin or Livermore and I invite all who are irritated by this to join me. I can get a damn burrito and an ice cream anywhere.
Posted by Annon, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 10:56 pm
I noticed a thread "topic" about Cholo a few days ago. People were getting on him. The entire thread was removed by the Weekly. I also noticed that the "editor" posts article a lot and there has been partial posts edited by admin. SO, PERHAPS CHOLO is a Weekly Employee?
Posted by Stacey, a resident of the Amberwood/Wood Meadows neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 11:07 pm Stacey is a member (registered user) of PleasantonWeekly.com
No, Cholo is more like...
The king is holding a banquet and everyone is drunk. The king calls in the court jester who proceeds to make fun of everyone. We all laugh. Some take him too seriously and get offended, which only makes everyone else laugh harder.
Posted by Stacey, a resident of the Amberwood/Wood Meadows neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 11:44 pm Stacey is a member (registered user) of PleasantonWeekly.com
Honestly, the fact that there's this sort of group coming to town makes me laugh. When exactly do they show up? I'd like to go check them out myself.
Posted by Stacey, a resident of the Amberwood/Wood Meadows neighborhood, on Jun 26, 2009 at 11:47 pm Stacey is a member (registered user) of PleasantonWeekly.com
It would be really funny if someone showed up as a joke in a Nazi outfit and started spouting Nazi invective like Hitler next to these people (not at them, but with them) and hailing Hitler like Charlie Chaplin in the movie The Great Dictator.
Posted by Jon, a resident of the Danbury Park neighborhood, on Jun 27, 2009 at 12:02 am
Stacy,
The high school kids have doone just that, without the outfits. Nothing phases these people, it just makes them feel superior.
I have seen "christians" try to talk with these people and they tell the "christians" .. "I know you are not saved" When asked how they know, they say, "Jesus told me" Bla, Bla, Bla
As to when they show up, it can be weekly, mothy or several months between. But when they are there, they are way too much!
Posted by chopo, a resident of Livermore, on Jun 27, 2009 at 9:51 am
What happened is that Jarhead posted a fake article that had the Contra Costa Times logo on it. The article indicated that "Cholo" had been arrested and taken to jail at Santa Rita for having sex with a sheep.
Then a whole horde of poster like jon, wow, paul and many others trashed "Cholo".
It was pure filth. wow continues to make reference to the "sheep"...
Posted by PToWN94566, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jun 27, 2009 at 10:34 am PToWN94566 is a member (registered user) of PleasantonWeekly.com
Why is it that these kinds of people can make all the noise they want on the street corner but we can't have the Good Guys Car Show (the parades they use to have where everyone could view the cars)?
Posted by Yo unclehomerr, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jun 27, 2009 at 4:41 pm
This is an indecency issue. Their language is profane and indecent. It is uttered in the presence on minors. It is an open an shut case. It may also include contributing to the delinquency of minors.
Posted by Julie, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jun 27, 2009 at 4:54 pm Julie is a member (registered user) of PleasantonWeekly.com
I really don't think the idea of free speech was intended for people to yell obscenities at people. There must be some loophole, as others have said - e.g. disturbing the peace, etc. - to get rid of these nuts. I wouldn't think that the free speech rights of one person or group should be allowed to infringe on the rights of others.
Posted by Cholo, a resident of Livermore, on Jun 27, 2009 at 5:13 pm
They cannot be deprived of their right to free speech.
This group will not leave until they are ready. And, they plan to continue to post their experience on utube!
The content of their speech is not offensive and they have not harmed or contributed to the delinquency of any children that encounter them.
I would strongly advise complainers to study 1st amendments rights so that you understand what their rights are. I have spoken to a few of the participants and they are not as determined to deprive anybody of their free speech rights. So what's the fuss? They were polite to me...I say thumbs up!
Posted by Betty, a resident of the Downtown neighborhood, on Jun 28, 2009 at 3:53 pm
"Cities may, by local ordinances, control excessive noise, and time and place (public places like parks should be left open) but cannot ban loudspeakers, or censor "annoying ideas."
I think the City should move forward with the "time and place" in town, if these folks keep coming around this summer. Perhaps they are already working on that?
Posted by Julie, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jun 29, 2009 at 7:54 am Julie is a member (registered user) of PleasantonWeekly.com
Posted by lifelong budies, a resident of the Pleasanton Heights neighborhood, on Jun 29, 2009 at 8:34 am
Folks -- please stop engaging in all this nonsensical bantering back and forth. The fact of the matter is, these people who are choosing Pleasanton to exercise their 1st amendment rights, are driving people away from the downtown businesses at and around the Tully's patio area. Last time we dined there was very unpleasant, and we will not go back.
Posted by Duh, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jun 29, 2009 at 8:53 am
Life Long...
Well said! We had the same experience while trying to enjoy an ice cream on a recent Saturday night. The guy literally yelled a t the top of this lungs " Fornicators, homosexuals, sinners, you are going to burn in hell" among other things. Just how do you explain that to a FOUR YEAR old? We try to keep our kids form watching questionable t.v. etc. This is Pleasanton and although not above any 1st amendment laws, these idiots are from the central valley and are purposely driving people away. I believe that they are not Christians, but are trying to win a lawsuit of some kind.
If this continues, we need to get a petition going to change the ordinance and set aside a park, a designated free speech area. I couldn't imagine anyone NOT signing a petition as even the mast evangelical Christians are very upset with these aggressive "FREAKS". THAT IS LEGAL! The park closest to Bernal at the end of Main St. would be GREAT! There IS foing to be a major problem if these people continue this summer and based upon the last two summers, they will!
Posted by Cholo, a resident of Livermore, on Jun 29, 2009 at 11:45 am
Aren't they simply testifying? Doesn't the christian bible request that they shout out?
Do you suppose that the way PT voted on Prop 8 has something to do with the presence of the street preachers? In a way, the voters paved the way. Maybe they view what the voters decided was spot on and they've decided to honor you with their presence. Maybe they're trying to drive out the devil?
They have attended street preacher legal rights training and that's why they carry cameras.
They film you and everybody that is nasty to them. They will absolutely sue you and the city if you harm them physically. So, don't kick them or harm them. You will NOT get away with it.
The ACLU has protected street preachers in the past and the Northern California Chapter of the ACLU will zoom in with their flash lights and light the sky if you harm them physically.
I'm going to bake some of my combination sheep/armadillo cookies and make a peace offering. YUP, that's me...ALWAYS TAKING THE HIGH ROAD!
Posted by Sheerluck_Holmes, a resident of the Jensen Tract neighborhood, on Jun 29, 2009 at 3:10 pm
Does anyone who hears this sort of thing actually say to himself, "I want to join that faith"? or "I'm so impressed with their words, I want to be just like them"? It would seem that most of the folks, at least on this forum, are turned off by these tactics. I have a young son and if he were to witness this I would simply explain that if you don't pay attention in school you'll end up just like them.
Posted by Cholo, a resident of Livermore, on Jun 29, 2009 at 9:51 pm
Books to help you understand Free Speech: Web Link
Also, the writings of Jacobo Timerman, an Argentine journalist who documented the atrocities of the Argentine Generals during the Bloody War. He was a great man, and advocate for free speech. He was imprisoned and tortured but that failed to silence him. One of the great men in support of free speech.
Pleasanton and the residents are ALL OVER the web! These people have published ALL these videos over the last few years! Perhaps that make those that have confronted them, potential "targets" just as abortion doctors have been???
Posted by Wow, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jun 30, 2009 at 5:08 pm
All,
So I just watched the video clips that the site Cholo provided shows.
I think these guys are loud, but I don't see what they are doing that is offensive?
From a religious perspective, while a little less than polished, do you understand these people are simply taking a bear-marketing approach. I see much more offensive bear-marketing on tv of sexually suggestive things daily...and that's not even the cable shows...that's just the commercials in the middle of the day!
The Bible is full of examples of Jesus himself demonstrating less than polished behavior, but even more explicit was John the Baptist's not so gentle messages of repentance.
Sure, you can call it what you like as you see it if you don't like the message, but if these people have a sincere love of others that they would go out and try to tell their message, what is the problem? I guess I kind of understand their perspective, if not necessarily their message format.
Have you considered that there are those that are not offended? Perhaps someone will be helped by them. You cannot say it has not happened...
It's very possible the vidoes were edited for content to show them as only doing good. But I never saw people protecting the main guy or referring to him as the Messiah, as was state above. Clearly the message was about THE Messiah. He clearly put himself subject to God and referred to him in third-person, not first-person. I also saw a few locals saying inappropriate things themselves and behaving in a manner to engage the speakers with negativity.
I'm not defending this group - I have no affliation with them, but if I can tolerate what I see in Berkeley and SF, surely people here in Pleasanton can tolerate a few "Hell fire and brimstone" preachers!
Posted by 2ME4U, a resident of the Birdland neighborhood, on Jul 4, 2009 at 1:21 pm
It's the yelling, not the verbage or message. No yelling, no problem. He's yelling to cause a problem, problem = people. Juggle, do whatever on the street you think you can do to draw a crowd for 5 minutes thn look up and count your spectators. At the same place set up a loud fake arguement between you and a friend and 5 minutes in look up and count. People love watching fights, like car accidents on the side of the road.
Posted by 2ME4U, a resident of the Birdland neighborhood, on Jul 6, 2009 at 5:23 pm
Psalm 35:20 (King James Version)
20For they speak not peace: but they devise deceitful matters against them that are quiet in the land.
Lamentations 3:26 (King James Version)
26It is good that a man should both hope and quietly wait for the salvation of the LORD.
Quiet can be good. We should try to avoid getting a crazy person's, or attention seeking person's religious beliefs tied to the person actions. Then you would hate Christianity because this guy or hate Muslims because 9-11. These people are in every town and village in the world.
Posted by Wow, Jon, a resident of the Another Pleasanton neighborhood neighborhood, on Jul 6, 2009 at 5:26 pm
Wow, Jon,
You seem to really enjoy stirring the pot and keeping your original posts at the top of the forum by continually commenting within. Why are you so motivated to encourage others to do the work you yourself would like? Have you looked into your own heart lately?
So they yell. People are free to walk away - even leave a restaurant in the middle of a meal (which I highly doubt ever even happened after the stellar examples of your "stories" you've given...just too far out..). People are free to yell and if someone doesn't like it, move along. They can come right up to you, but if you walk away, they don't run along side of you or chase you.
You are keeping this ridiculous thread going for some wierd self-interest and I think it's time you sat by yourself.
Posted by Jon, a resident of the Danbury Park neighborhood, on Jul 6, 2009 at 9:56 pm
Hey "Wow Jon" whoever you are or are not?
You have a problem with me commenting on a thread I started?
I am motivated by my disgust in these angry fools yelling things that I do NOT wish for my child and family to be subject to. Yes, we were eating dinner outside the first time, and NO I do not feel that it is right for my family to have to get up in the middle of our dinner and leave.
Everyone is FREE to say anything including you! Everyone is FREE to comment on what others do and say as well
I have run into these people several times and the majority of those who have experienced them are DISGUSTED! The police get MANY calls every time these guys come. They are very aggressive and disruptive, to say the least!
View in an RSS Reader
E-mail this topic.
Print this topic.
