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State controller wants community college payrolls made public

Original post made on Aug 4, 2011

State Controller John Chiang has asked California Community Colleges Chancellor Jack Scott to make public data showing compensation for all administration, faculty and other employee salaries in the system.

Read the full story here Web Link posted Thursday, August 4, 2011, 7:15 AM

Comments (21)

Posted by Elle, a resident of Canyon Meadows
on Aug 4, 2011 at 8:49 am

They need to do this for CSU and UC as well. Admin makes all the decisions and are not likely to cut their own superfluous and sometimes unnecessary positions. Conflict of interest


Posted by Incredulous, a resident of Birdland
on Aug 4, 2011 at 9:34 am

@'Admin makes all the decisions and are not likely to cut their own superfluous and sometimes unnecessary positions.'

Care to illuminate us with your vast knowledge of such matters and tell us which positions at which universities are superfluous and sometimes unnecessary? Didn't think so.


Posted by steve, a resident of Parkside
on Aug 4, 2011 at 9:50 am

impatient increduous-your short attention span has probably lead you away from this site to huffpo or msnbc by now. At least there, they will spoon feed you the leftist drivel you crave.
However, if you had decided to make even the slightest effort (I know, effort is discourage, as you might attain something without govt help) you could have found this short list posted on the UC Irvine website's faculty list:

•Diversity Resources
•Office of Equal Opportunity & Diversity
•ADVANCE Program
Office of Research Administration
•Emeriti Association
•EEE – Electronic Education Environment
•FACNET
•DUE – Division of Undergraduate Education
•UROP – Undergraduate Research Opportunities Program
•Academic Personnel
•EH&S – Environmental Health & Safety
•Office of the Ombuds
•Whistleblower Information
•Sexual Harassment Prevention Office
•Report Acts of Intolerance


Posted by dknute, a resident of Birdland
on Aug 4, 2011 at 9:51 am

wonder if john would want his staff's salary published?


Posted by Patriot, a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Aug 4, 2011 at 9:59 am

steve,

You wrote "Office of Research Administration".

You're kidding, right? Have you ever been to college? Do you know what "Research" is? Why on Earth would you say that was superfluous? Maybe you don't like things like this:

"The Beckman Laser Institute (BLI) was established in 1982 by Dr. Arnold O. Beckman and Dr. Michael W. Berns as an interdisciplinary center for the development and application of optical technologies in biology and medicine. Since the opening in 1986, Beckman Laser Institute has grown to include 18 faculty and their 130 affiliated students, postdoctoral fellows, technical staff, and administrative support. BLI is one of five national Beckman Institutes supported by the Arnold and Mabel Beckman Foundation. BLI is dedicated to cutting-edge interdisciplinary research and the interface of physical science, engineering, and biology. Because BLI also houses a medical clinic, it is unique in its capacity for conducting translational research that moves basic technologies rapidly from "benchtop to bedside."

Web Link


Posted by steve, a resident of Parkside
on Aug 4, 2011 at 10:12 am

patriot-thanks for cherry-picking the one redundant position (yes, there is also a separate dept called 'Office of Research' in addition to the one you focused on) and acknowledging the all the others listed as being superfluos and unnecessary.
No need to thank me for performing this bit of 'research' for you.


Posted by Blossom, a resident of Stoneridge Orchards
on Aug 4, 2011 at 10:24 am

Of course, like Steve, I know nothing about the list he printed. He seems to know nothing about the depts/programs listed, accept that these are part of a university and he doesn't like them. I don't like them either. Don't ask me why. Like Steve, I just like to vent my venom at all of you who are not hard-working-ignorant like he and me are. Don't dilude yourselfs, its a matter of principal.


Posted by College Bound, a resident of Heritage Valley
on Aug 4, 2011 at 11:43 am

Steve, I'm here visiting my grandmother and read with interest your criticism of so many offices at UC Irvine where I'm attending this Fall. Can you single out some of them and tell me what's wrong with them? You say they should be cut or eliminated because they are superfluous? I don't understand what you mean or why you'd say such a thing. I sure would find your comments helpful. Thank you in advance.


Posted by prop 209, a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Aug 4, 2011 at 3:14 pm

Yes, Las Positas CC and the UCs and all in the state should open their books.
I want to see Cal's books, whose pres & chancellor say their primary goal is 'diversity'. They lie. In fact it is blatent 'preferences'....discrimination against our native born, white males. But, we the people voted for EQUALITY, not picking and choosing, playing favorites and practicing 'preferences'.
I heard last year there was a person at LosPositas who was to target illegals for the purpose of DISTRIBUTING CASH...real greenbacks with no tracking....to help the poor underclass.
There are so many programs, for the sole purpose of arbitrarily filling slots ahead of average, native families. I'm really sick of it. In times like this, their only consideration should be playing fairly, GPAs and SATs period....no excuses, juggling, 'subjective' background stories, etc. Plenty of average white kids have their own troubling stories for last couple years making it impossible for even honor students to get in. GPAs should be used until the slots are full and assistance to advance their goals. But, Cal should not be out recruiting and pushing low scores into filling seats if they are not qualified....these kids are also often too poor for Cal, yet Cal not only pushes them in, but also provides free rides.... favorities over those who ARE qualified but can't afford. IF it's about education, then education qualifications ought to come first...not discrimnatory social engineering. I know the outlawing of preferences in prop 209 is violated daily.
Yes, let us open the books....lifetime taxpayers are entitled to an accounting. IF some of us taxpayers can't send our own kids to college this year, we damn well have a right to see just whose kids we are forced to provide for...program by program.


Posted by Common sense & experience, a resident of Bordeaux Estates
on Aug 4, 2011 at 4:26 pm

"Posted by Incredulous, a resident of the Birdland neighborhood, 6 hours ago

@'Admin makes all the decisions and are not likely to cut their own superfluous and sometimes unnecessary positions.'


Care to illuminate us with your vast knowledge of such matters and tell us which positions at which universities are superfluous and sometimes unnecessary? Didn't think so."

The ones that aren't necessary; there are many that would help reduce the cost of education. I don't know about the JC's, but there is a huge amount of compensation going to people in both the State & UC system that do little if anything.

if a recession is good for anything it is clearing out the dead wood.


Posted by Cal Grad w/Doctorate, a resident of Charter Oaks
on Aug 4, 2011 at 4:26 pm

Hey there Prop 209. You seem obsessed with the idea that white males are discriminated against. Oh, sorry, that's NATIVE BORN white males. Let me tell you something: if not for administrative tinkering, there wouldn't be as many white males as there are currently enrolled. Stroll across a UC campus some day, should you know where any are. You'll find 'disproportionate' numbers of Asian Americans and foreign students. Know why? Because native born white males can't compete. This is largely because America's middle classes don't produce very many good parents. Devoted exclusively to pursuit of the almighty buck, most parents haven't a clue as to how to cultivate a multi-dimensioned young adult. Add to this the fact that America's middle class is made up of poorly educated yokels -- see frequent contributors to these posts, as their grammar and spelling leaves one not knowing whether to laugh or cry -- and your lament is nothing but that. Go ahead, though, and blame the system for your own incompetencies.

BTW, I don't think you know diddley-squat about Cal in any of its facets. You're merely reciting lies and untruths that you've made up or acquired from other liars like yourself. Sorry to hear you haven't raised your kids to effectively compete in today's world. You gave them all those economic advantages -- big tv's and video games -- and, surprise-surprise, they're not getting admitted into top schools. Pathetic.


Posted by Incredulous, a resident of Birdland
on Aug 4, 2011 at 4:41 pm

Dear alleged Common sense. You say you know about the UC system and that there is dead wood. Care to elaborate and name an office or person who fits this description? Didn't think so. You're every bit as ignorant as Steve is. I wonder why....


Posted by prop 209, a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Aug 4, 2011 at 10:45 pm

Hey, phony 'doctorate', your irrelevant rant was about nothing but assumptions, since you can't or didn't read. First, they are not my children, false assumption. Second, the two boys I referred to are 'honor' students.
Again, if you could read, my entire comment was that the "only consideration should be playing fairly, using GPA and SATs, period.....no 'subjective' judgements. I think admissions should all be equal and fair, and the only way that could be is with GPAs.
What is pathetic is your irrelevant diatribe. I won't stoop to your childish name-calling, based on falsehoods, but I can't image how any rational person would be against using GPAs, as a basis for admissions. As I see it, that is the only fair objective method, and was the purpose of Ward Conerly's prop 209, eliminating preferences of administrators obsessed with personal bias. Open your eyes, it's now 2011...time to give up old sterotypes.


Posted by Gina, a resident of Highland Oaks
on Aug 4, 2011 at 11:17 pm

It doesn't take someone with a doctorate to recognize an idiotic argument when they see one. GPA eh? Simple as that? What about schools that have different GPA standards one from the next -- e.g., urban v rural, private v public? What about teachers/administrators/owners/home-schooler parents who are willing to lie about their students' grades?

What about the richies who hire tutors or who can afford to pay thousands of dollars to SAT prep institutions? Not that long ago I 'aced' the LSAT with a perfect score. I was lucky to have a girlfriend at the time who smuggled me over sixty practice exams she had access to working for a test-preparing agency. My first practice exam? I scored in the 60th percentile range; when I finally took the test after doing 60 practice exams, like I say, I got a perfect score. Was that fair? I think richies take advantage of that kind of 'fairness' all the time. (BTW I did not go to law school, despite being accepted with partial scholarships by Columbia, Hastings, and Iowa.)

In case you hadn't noticed - a convenient thing for traditionally inordinately privileged and advantaged native born white males - both GREs and SATs, even when taken together are not very good indicators of collegiate success, at all.

Face it, Prop 209. You belong to a dying demographic that, now faced with genuine competition from ethnic minorities, women, and immigrants, is increasingly compelled to drop out in order to install lawn sprinklers and stock walmart shelves. If you didn't cut it, it isn't because some admissions officer who knows a whole lot more about assessment of candidates than you do discriminated against your native born male whiteness (un-___-believable!) but rather because you weren't good enough to pass muster. Accept reality. P.S. You aren't a very good writer. You can't spell very well and you have no idea where to place a comma. No way your cover letter and statement of intent would impress anyone. You wouldn't get past the first round. Out! Next! Typical incompetent native born white male who expects privileged treatment when none is deserved.


Posted by Yet Another Teacher, a resident of Hart Middle School
on Aug 5, 2011 at 10:46 am

Gina: You aspired to be a lawyer (an officer of the court) and yet you admit you received stolen property?

"I was lucky to have a girlfriend at the time who smuggled me over sixty practice exams she had access to working for a test-preparing agency."

Good thing you didn't become a lawyer, then. You'd have been suspended or disbarred for receiving those 60 tests, knowing that your friend had no right ("smuggled") to take them from work (it's called "stealing").

I have no intention of defending prop 209 nor his odious views on white supremacy/entitlement. I have no intention of attacking him, either, because his views are clearly repellent to any thinking person.

However, I do take issue with this: "You belong to a dying demographic that, now faced with genuine competition from ethnic minorities, women, and immigrants, is increasingly compelled to drop out in order to install lawn sprinklers and stock walmart shelves."

Sounds like you look down on the people who stock Wal-Mart shelves and lawn sprinklers? And perhaps all manual laborers/retail trade workers?

I don't. That's hard work. Those people are performing necessary jobs in our society, or else those jobs wouldn't exist.

It's nice to have options so that you don't have to do a particular sort of work because it's the only kind you can find, but not everybody is lucky enough to have choices. Gina, exhibiting your own prejudices against working class people while attacking another person's racial prejudice hardly wins you an audience.


Posted by Stacey, a resident of Amberwood/Wood Meadows
on Aug 5, 2011 at 10:50 am

Stacey is a registered user.

The abyss stares back at Gina.


Posted by Gina, a resident of Highland Oaks
on Aug 5, 2011 at 11:28 am

Quite to the contrary, YAT. I have the highest regard for lawn sprinkler installers. Some of my best friends have been lawn sprinkler installers. I've had lawn sprinkler installers in my home. Only, you'll have to understand, I wouldn't want my daughters to marry a lawn sprinkler installer -- not because I have anything against lawn sprinkler installers, but rather because I desire for my kids to have broader life options than those offered by the lawn sprinkling profession. Nor, for the same reason, would I want my daughters to aspire to be lawn sprinkler installers. Should they choose to become lawn sprinkler installers, I would hope they'd have made that choice only after they've graduated from a decent university that presents them with problems in the world that need solving, and opportunities for themselves to become problem solvers.

Many of us strive for upward mobility. Few of us strive for downward mobility. I think this is rational behavior. It may well be informed by my bias: I do very much hope my kids become medical doctors rather than lawn sprinkler installers. I think colleges hold a similar bias: Very few offer degrees in lawn sprinkler installation.

Yes, what I did back then was unethical. Not being from a wealthy social class, working as a ditch digger at the time, I couldn't afford the 1200 bucks it cost to buy the exams back then. I am sooooo ashamed! NOT. The system of ethics was geared to favor those who had money to buy practice exams. It was an ethical system geared to sustain the privilege of the wealthy and their progeny.

Was it illegal? That I used the archived exams as practice material to my advantage while others were doing the same, albeit having shelled out $1200 to do so? Maybe, though I doubt it. (My girlfriend returned the borrowed exams.) Was it immoral? Well, YAT, I don't think so. But then, you'll understand, I don't think illegal crossing of the border to find work and uplift one's chances in the world for oneself and one's children is an immoral act either.

Thanks for your comments, YAT. Always much appreciated.

Stacey: Always a pleasure to entertain your thoughtful remarks.




Posted by Gina, a resident of Highland Oaks
on Aug 5, 2011 at 12:10 pm

YAT, thanks again for your query. Since you asked, I do want to clarify one other thing about my bias. I especially don't want my kids to be shelf stockers at walmart, as in addition to the lack of life opportunities such an occupation entails, it also is a hellish environment to work in where one has little if any control over one's body and time. One evening I strolled through at about 3 AM, and it was like stepping into Dante's inferno. There is nothing 'free' about laboring in walmart. People are there out of extreme desperation and because of that condition they submit themselves to sweatshop conditions of exploitation. I see my own situation, where I do extremely well, have considerable freedom, and can distribute my time over the day and night any way I like, and then I look at the conditions of work in walmart, and it makes me want to cry.


Posted by Mike, a resident of Highland Oaks
on Aug 5, 2011 at 8:34 pm

My kids are at Cal, and I don't see any conspiracies: they are good students who prepared properly for their chosen fields.

Should salaries be published? Sure. Regardless of their function, civil servants are paid by me. I have a right to know what I'm paying them.

Is college too expensive? I've said it before: a thing is only expensive if its price exceeds its value. I think Cal would be a bargain at twice the price. No, let me take that back: with the scholarships my kids get for their grades, Cal would be a bargain at thrice the price.


Posted by Yet Another Teacher, a resident of Hart Middle School
on Aug 5, 2011 at 10:12 pm

Gina: You have just written that the monetary value of the practice exams was $1200.

That means they were valuable, and they were "smuggled", to use your own words.

You cheated that company of $1200.

Stealing is stealing, whether you are poor or rich.

And the fact that your girlfriend returned the stolen items after you had taken their value (i.e., studied them thoroughly) does little to ameliorate the crime.

What you did wasn't just unethical, it was also illegal. With such a cavalier attitude towards the law, it's a good thing you didn't become an officer of the court.


Posted by Gina, a resident of Highland Oaks
on Aug 5, 2011 at 10:59 pm

Yes, YAT, alas, you're probably right on all counts, and especially that I best shouldn't have become a lawyer where my ethical failings would have stuck out like a sore thumb among all of our morally upstanding lawyers and judges. But yes, guilty as charged. And worse, that was only one of multiple youthful transgressions. I've pondered this long and hard. Should I turn myself into the authorities? Should I send $1200 to Kaplan, along with probably another 20 grand in interest? Or, worse, should I stop reading my Nietzsche?

Thanks again so much for this lesson in morality. I'll be sure in the future never to send a needing undocumented immigrant to your house for food or shelter, as that would constitute aiding and abetting wouldn't it? And law is law, after all, and no law is better or worse than any other law.

Cavalierly yours,
G


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