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Setting The Example

Original post made by Political Moderate, Another Pleasanton neighborhood, on Oct 26, 2009

I recently heard that Senators and Congressmen/women as well as Obama himself dodged the question of whether they would 'take the Public Healthcare Option' if it is approved by the powers to be. I believe as our leaders, they should set the example by lining up and sign up for the public healthcare option they have carefully crafted for the American people. I believe it is only fair that they lead us and show us the plans they have drawn up are good for everyone, including themselves! Americans, this is your chance to tell your duely elected officials to lead by example! Surely, no one can challenge this charge!

Comments (19)

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Posted by Stay Cool
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 26, 2009 at 7:30 am

Stay Cool is a registered user.

I would encourage you to do some more research about what it means to 'sign up for the public healthcare option' before you condemn government officials for not signing up. Briefly, it is just that, an *option,* for people who currently don't have insurance options.


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Posted by Anonymous
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 26, 2009 at 8:25 am

The only reason that repubican congressman is trying to get government officials to sign up for the public option they vote for is that he does not want a public option at all.

I do not like the health care proposals so far, but the republicans are really not helping, they are just saying no to everything without coming up with good solutions. Of course, what can you expect, we had 6 years of republican everything (Bush, congress) and what did they accomplish? Oh, yeah, a big recession and not so good management as far as war (after all, they seemed to have gone after the wrong country).

Here is the link to the congressman's site, the one pushing for the government to sign up for the public option IF they vote yes for the healthcare bill. Notice how he excludes anyone (from the public option) who will vote no:

Web Link

(the name is house resolution 615) - I never saw something so silly, and this congressman's site uses terms such as Obamacare, etc, the republicans should get their act together.

And no, I am not a fan of Obama, I am an independent voter who voted for Obama because he was the "lesser of two evils" not because I thought his ideas were great. But the republicans so far have not given me any reason to vote for them again - they seem to be counting on Obama's bad policies to get people's vote. But we don't want to go from the frying pan to the fire, do we?


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Posted by mary
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 26, 2009 at 8:57 am

We're screwed. That's all there is to it.


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Posted by Cholo
a resident of Livermore
on Oct 26, 2009 at 9:46 am

It's now referred to as Medicare Part E (for Everybody) which also includes "illegals"!

HORRAY!!!


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Posted by Trish
a resident of Country Fair
on Oct 26, 2009 at 2:35 pm

Cool Thinks the Pres can say 'do as I SAY, NO do as I DO'. I with the principle of setting an example !!! Annon, you say you don't like the health care proposals you seen so far....Well, in that case saying NO is the only sensible reply !!! All of this chaos & cost & change for majority of America, just to 'insure' a few million of the inner-city unemployable, is a deplorable assult on the majority of Americans. . . . NOW, today, Sen Reid, whose state does NOT want the public option is writing the senate bill with states OPT out. They tell us the REASON we don't have adequate insurance and
'desperately' need a health care bill is so MORE PEOPLE WILL BE IN THE POOL. So, 40 mainstream states will OPT OUT & 10 leftist & poverty states will opt in....thus NOT ENOUGH INSUREDS to get the cost DOWN!!!!! CA being liberal leftist ((just look at the dummie legislature the stupid voters elect)) so CA would vote to opt in, then ALL CALIFORNIANS WILL BE STUCK IN A NATIONAL PROGRAM THAT MOST COMMON SENSE PEOPLE WITH A DEGREE OF INTELLIGENCE WOULD PREFER TO BE OUT, BUT THE DICTATE WILL THRUST US INTO SOMETHING WE DON'T WANT. Mass exodus OUT of CA for the brighter people.


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Posted by Stay Cool
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 26, 2009 at 4:20 pm

Stay Cool is a registered user.

Darlene, I mean Trish,
If you would like to make comments on the plan, feel free to do so but without assuming you know exactly what I, or anyone else on this board, thinks. Our elected representatives are going to vote on a bill, possibly one with a state opt-out for the public option. I am surprised at your assumption about 40 states opting out and curious as to what the 10 "leftist and poverty states" are, or what that even means, for that matter. As one of the brighter people, you can then make the choice to join the mass exodus out of California.


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Posted by Robis Pierre
a resident of Downtown
on Oct 26, 2009 at 4:37 pm

Trish,

To paraphrase the Republican healthcare plan, (Part 1: Don't get sick Part 2: if you get sick, die quickly);

don't wait. Leave town quickly!


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Posted by Stay Cool
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 26, 2009 at 4:42 pm

Stay Cool is a registered user.

I actually just read Darlene, I mean Trish's entire post. The comment, "...just to 'insure' a few million of the inner-city unemployable..." tells me everything I need to know. Wow.


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Posted by Robis Pierre
a resident of Downtown
on Oct 26, 2009 at 4:43 pm

Mary,

Are you objecting to the refusal of the insurance industry to cover birth control while at the same time covering Viagra?

If so, then I understand your comment.


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Posted by Robis Pierre
a resident of Downtown
on Oct 26, 2009 at 5:08 pm

This topic is similar to the Pelosi thread, so I will reposte:

When I moved here from France, I was completely shocked by the lack of good health care here. I find it sad but amusing that the great majority of Americans whom have never been outside the United States know how bad national health care is on another continent.

You are aware that the US is the only major industrialized nation to not have national healthcare aren't you?

Does it surprize you that a country as small and impoverished (thanks to US embargo) as Cuba has a better health care system? During the aftermath of Katrina in New Orleans, Cuba offered to send 600 Doctors to help. Coming from Cuba, I am sure that they have great experience with hurricane health issues. But the idiot turned them down.

New content:

This debate frequently returns to the cost of the program. This year the total expenditures for health care will be approximately 2 trillion dollars. Who in God's name thinks that that is not enough to provide coverage for everyone?

Item % of Fed spending % of GDP
Medicare 23.00% 4.79%
Defense 21.00% 4.37%
Social Security 21.00% 4.37%
Other Discretionary 17.00% 3.54%
Other Mandatory 10.00% 2.08%
Interest on debt 8.00% 1.67%
TARP Wall Street bail out 25.18% 5.26%
Health care expenditures 70.00% 14.58%

If I recall correctly, health care if not reorganized will equal about 30% of GDP in about 10 years or so.

The Defense numbers above are inaccurate because the Bush administration never funded the wars through the budget process. When Paul Bremer was the Czar of Iraq, about 12 billion dollars disappeared. Before the Congress, Bremer's comment was: Well it was only 12 billion and you should expect to misplace funds during a war." Where were the fiscal conservatives when Bush was plundering the country? I know your answer: Ah yes, billions for war and theft, but not a damn penny for healthcare!

A recent study shows that 44,000 Americans die each year as a result of no health insurance coverage. How much are 44,000 lives year in and year out worth?

Remember, how much we have spent to get even with Iraq for 9-11 for not being part of the deaths of 3,000 Americans? More than the CBO estimate for healthcare reform.


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Posted by Anonymous
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 26, 2009 at 9:56 pm

Robis Pierre:

So why do so many europeans come here to the US to live? I am just wondering....

Your assumptions that Americans have not been to another continent is very silly. When I was in London, I got to see their healthcare system, and to be honest, I'd rather have the US one, even with all its problems, than the one over there. That being said, I do wonder why europeans like you who criticize the US so much, come here and stay, any thoughts?


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Posted by Political Moderate
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 26, 2009 at 10:16 pm

It's cool that my topic generated so much discussion! It's interesting how some people can still continue to support such a major reform so a few can get insurance! Wow! By the way, the illegals and the poor already a figured a way to use the existng system to extract the health benefits. It's called th free clinics. So are we now trying to get the derelicts on the insurance plan too! We get to pay for it! Wow! We are truly the land of opportunity!


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Posted by robis pierre
a resident of Downtown
on Oct 27, 2009 at 3:00 am

To anonymous,

I hope there is only one anonymous, (at least make up a name, like: "draws incorrect conclusions from personal anecdotal incidents, and applies them to the full set." I will call you draws for short.)

Draws,

What do you mean, "got to see their healthcare system?"

Did you get sick?

Did they turn you away because you didn't have insurance?

Did you die because you didn't have insurance?

Did your personal experience apply to millions of citizens?

Do you have health insurance here?

Are you an insurance executive?

Are you a doctor flying to Europe on your personal jet?

Please explain your comment.

I have met many native born Americans and only a very few have been outside of the US and most of those go to the Carribean, not Europe. So you are exceptional! Very nice, yes. But maybe I just don't know any wealthy Americans who travel to Europe.

I don't know how many Europeans move here now or why. Do you? How many Europeans move here now and what is your source?

But for me:
My papa passed away on vacation here many years ago, mama insists on being near him.

I do not criticize the US. We French love the US. You even named your snack food after us. Your revolution inspired our own revolution. We gave you the Statue of Liberty. Twice you sent troops to save us from war. Vive l'America!

Do you ever criticize your wife or son or daughter? Because you love someone or something, does not mean, that it is perfect, or above constructive criticizm, No?

I criticize the greedy, exploitative health insurance and health care system.

Why doesn't anyone opposed to reform answer my questions:

How much are 44,000 deaths a year worth to you in dollars?

and

How much is a single human life worth in dollars?

Here is another question, Assume you are without health insurance and are dying from a curable disease. If I offer to pay for your health bills, will you say, no let me die because I do not believe anyone has the obligation to help someone else?

Or maybe the answer is keeping your money for yourself is more important to you than keeping a dying person alive?

You don't answer because you know it is immoral to let people die because they are poor.


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Posted by Robis Pierre
a resident of Downtown
on Oct 27, 2009 at 3:08 am

Political Moderate,

You use very pejorative terms and then claim to be a moderate?

I smell a fish.

Do you really consider 47 million uninsured a few?

If the so called illegals and the poor are already paid for in the system, then reforming it to lower costs is simply a rational budget decision. Your own argument supports reform.

If illegals and the poor are already getting health insurance, who are the derelicts you refer to? Maybe we should round up those derelicts and make them work on a chain gang to pay for their healthcare?


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Posted by pseudonym
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 27, 2009 at 7:51 am

Our elected officials are not going to be eligible for the public option -- it is only for people who do not get insurance through work (those who work for small companies, in particular).


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Posted by Anonymous
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 27, 2009 at 6:01 pm

"What do you mean, "got to see their healthcare system?""

I was visiting a friend who happens to live in London - bay area native married to a british guy. Her child had an illness and she had a really hard time getting the proper care. She ended up flying back to the US and got top notch care. Being turned away means different things to different people: for my friend, not getting the proper treatment needed was essentially like being turned away.

I am not a doctor flying on a personal jet. You sound quite ignorant thinking that only wealthy people go to Europe. Most people I know have been to Europe, and they are not wealthy. I have traveled all over Europe, and I am not wealthy. Talk about assumptions!

I do not know how many europeans move to the US, but there are many all over. In fact, I sold one of my houses to a european couple. One of my children was in a soccer team with a kid whose parents were french, another whose parent were from Scotland, the list goes on. Many people from Europe move to the US, but I do not know how many.

My point was: if you dislike the US and its problems, it is not up to you to vote on how to fix them, and if you are that unhappy, it is amazing you continue to live here.

Many people would be happy to know you are willing to pay their health care bills. Have you heard though, of being independent, making a living on your own, and yes, paying your own bills and health insurance? What a concept!

By the way, we do have insurance for the poor: Medical in California, Medicaid is a federal program, Medicare is for seniors. And if you have lived here long enough, then you would know that a poor person, even if that person is illegal, can walk into a clinic and get free care. Yes, here in the USA.


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Posted by Anonymous
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 27, 2009 at 6:04 pm

"What do you mean, "got to see their healthcare system?""

Robis Pierre:

I was visiting a friend who happens to live in London - bay area native married to a british guy. Her child had an illness and she had a really hard time getting the proper care. She ended up flying back to the US and got top notch care. Being turned away means different things to different people: for my friend, not getting the proper treatment needed was essentially like being turned away.

I am not a doctor flying on a personal jet. You sound quite ignorant thinking that only wealthy people go to Europe. Most people I know have been to Europe, and they are not wealthy. I have traveled all over Europe, and I am not wealthy. Talk about assumptions!

I do not know how many europeans move to the US, but there are many all over. In fact, I sold one of my houses to a european couple. One of my children was in a soccer team with a kid whose parents were french, another whose parent were from Scotland, the list goes on. Many people from Europe move to the US, but I do not know how many.

My point was: if you dislike the US and its problems, it is not up to you to vote on how to fix them, and if you are that unhappy, it is amazing you continue to live here.

Many people would be happy to know you are willing to pay their health care bills. Have you heard though, of being independent, making a living on your own, and yes, paying your own bills and health insurance? What a concept!

By the way, we do have insurance for the poor: Medical in California, Medicaid is a federal program, Medicare is for seniors. And if you have lived here long enough, then you would know that a poor person, even if that person is illegal, can walk into a clinic and get free care. Yes, here in the USA.


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Posted by Mary
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 28, 2009 at 9:39 am

Robis - Yes, that would be a specific objection but there are too many to list. I am concerned with the overall issues, and also with the people making them. Unlike some of the fellow posters I do value your out-of-the-country perspective especially given that I have lived abroud, though not in Europe.

First, and a bit satirically, I find it daunting that our gov't wants to pass a health care plan written by a committee whose head says he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that hasn't read it but exempts themselves from it, signed by a president that also hasn't read it and who smokes, with funding administered by a treasury chief who didn't pay his taxes, overseen by a surgeon general who is obese, and financed by a country that's bankrupt.

Second, We lived in a top (modern)asian country with national healthcare and had to fly my son home on an emergency basis due to their means by which they would handle his surgery (excluding me in any knowledge of what his diagnosis was and how it would be best handled, due to the fact that I was a untrained woman and a mother who would only be able to perceive this information from an emotional perspective - so basically they wanted to protect me from these important matters - hence, we skipped town and returned home). Yes, that part had more to do with the culture than the govt healthcare but the latter part played a heavy hand and also played a hand in trying to participate in my son's care.

Following that we lived in another (rising, but far from top) asian country where again I had to fly home due to govt control over my healthcare and horrendous lack of standards in that care. Beyond my situations, my asian friends told me countless horror stories of behind the scenes scams by govt. Okay, it was communist, but my own government is beginning to feel less democratic, and I am leary.

Robis, we are far from wealthy but if I am hearing you right I am in agreement with you. After getting rid of the inequities like the coverages of viagra and not birth control (birth control is covered nationally by Planned Parenthood so that may be why the govt opts out)I do think the disadavantaged or uninsured need some help. And I do think they need to stop dropping people for pre-existing conditions.

hmmm. Thanks for your thoughts, Robis.





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Posted by Jeanne
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 28, 2009 at 10:29 am

Hey Robis...I guess the French Nationalized health care doesn't include dentistry, right? I've never seen so many folks with rotten and crooked teeth as when I was in France. Also, if they're all saving so much on health care why are they unable to afford deodorant? Seriously thought I was going to gag so many times when I was on public transportation or standing next to the "French" in tight quarters! Oh, and my personal favorite is all of the dog crap all over the sidewalk, no one picks up their pooches' poop, so sanitar! I saw a tourist slip and fall on a pile of fresh doo doo, how does that fit into the health care system???


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